1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

BDO pay to win my opinion

Discussion in 'General Gameplay' started by Demozic, Oct 14, 2018.

?

Do you find my opinion valid?

  1. Yes

    28.6%
  2. No

    53.6%
  3. yes and no

    17.9%
  1. Josh28

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    366
    Likes Received:
    307
    This is a naive view. But I admit, I actually thought the same when I started. The "conveniences" only increase with time. Example: Artisan memories only provided like 1 extra dura before and now it's 4 extra dura... The psychological marketing propaganda is too subtle to notice right away or the true impact it has unless you are experienced in that...
    The P2W before BDO were games where you got something that is only available with CASH and not in-game currency. But that has changed over the years because people are more aware of p2w microtransactions. Albeit, not everyone. This game: Star Citizen is selling premium packages for 33 000$ and people are still defending it saying IT'S NOT P2W. There was also that fiasco with star-wars and EA where the company overdid it with "conveniences" They sold items for cash that took many months if not years to get in-game. The company lost 4 mills and closed the server, or so I heard.
    The P2W nowadays is a meter: How much convenient are the microtransactions in X game. Pick any game and throw all the money you can at it to see how fast you get stuff compared to the FREE method.
    In GW2, money can get you top gear in a week or two whereas hard work probably takes a month at least if you are lucky. It won't be much money either unless you want legendaries which cost 200$ but it's just cosmetic and progress ends there. Once you get that...there's only the new expansions which is a 1-time buy every year or so for the horrible price of 50$
    In WoW, you pay expansions, buy gold or pay gold to get stuff and get everything in a week that otherwise takes you 6 months? The money won't be much either because you'll get everything right away.
    In Blade and Soul, you pay 30 000$ and you are KING! At least for 6 months to a year when they render your weapon partially useless. The free way to upgrade weapon is nearly impossible without a guild that carries you or several months of grind.
    In BDO however... Well, people have added that already, and it's at least 400$ in to be decently ahead in terms of 1/5 the progress. BUT if you throw a few thousand bucks and get all conveniences...things change...drastically.
    So how should we decide the p2w meter? By the total money spent during a lifetime play or by how much convenience it adds? 30 000$ might get you full PEN in a month whereas the free way could you take you 5 years? If you are lucky or cheat or join a SMH guild.
    Also, that argument that Cron Stones sell at the npc for 1 mill have been laughed and ridiculed quite a lot on these forums...
     
    Shedo likes this.
  2. Reuter

    Reuter Tamer 61 EU

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2016
    Messages:
    698
    Likes Received:
    1,333
    Nice try Cuckao
     
    Life2v likes this.
  3. Demozic

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2018
    Messages:
    40
    Likes Received:
    8
    everything comes out to the same at the end not one really gives a logi......
    ah nvm i guess....
     
  4. Demozic

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2018
    Messages:
    40
    Likes Received:
    8
    cuckao what is that
     
  5. Reuter

    Reuter Tamer 61 EU

    Joined:
    Feb 17, 2016
    Messages:
    698
    Likes Received:
    1,333
    The company you are trying to defend with that buIIshit post of yours.

    May I ask how long you've actually played the game and what your level and gear looks like? You're either a troll on a secondary account, or some clueless Olvia player.
     
  6. Silowyi

    Silowyi Wizard NA

    Joined:
    Feb 13, 2016
    Messages:
    1,902
    Likes Received:
    1,724
    Its all about $
     

    Attached Files:

  7. levinano

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2016
    Messages:
    593
    Likes Received:
    465
    This is the exact reason why veteran BDO players say BDO is P2W... sure nobody'll force you to pay (for conveniences) to advance, but every time you go to a grind spot and get one shot by some rich player who played less than you, is less skilled than you, but have better gear because they had 4x more attempts at upgrading via Crons and Arts, you'll feel this fire within you, one that either makes you go "man I need to start spending money," or the other being "man fok this P2W game," or worst, both + spreading your frustration on social media and to your other friends (lol).

    If you haven't fought a lot of other players, you probably don't know how much this P2W gear gap is. If you want, you can go to Velia 4's battle arena and literally try to fight anyone and see how that goes. Or try life skilling or wait till you have to start grinding in the desert when the lack of weight and inventory space limits you to oblivion (you can buy stuff from the loyalty shop but it has a limit, even after you max out buying them you'll realize you still don't have enough).

    I get your frustration with everyone blowing the P2W out of scale. I'm also glad that you can enjoy the game with less than $100 and I hope it can stay that way for you, but honestly, by the time when endgame rolls along.........
     
    Shedo likes this.
  8. levinano

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2016
    Messages:
    593
    Likes Received:
    465
    You don't really have to be mean about it but...

     
  9. Josh28

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    366
    Likes Received:
    307
    Saying a game isn't p2w just because 1 player doesn't feel the need to spend 2 Cents whereas countless others fall for the "convenience" marketing which isn't technically forced on them is egocentric. I started out as a free to play player too and after torturing myself for 3 months, I grabbed my card, and it was....pure relief! The game is too constrained without the conveniences to be called that. Depending on what you do, of course. So, I understand the need to get "conveniences."

    I only know 2 people who play this game without spending a dime(after buying once) and they don't care if it's p2w. One of them actually tells me that it's not P2W. What does he do? Grind all day, got Grunil to TRI, and doesn't do ANY lifeskill. He's been over a year in the game since he started months before me and this is all he's achieved. I'm starting to question if he actually has fun.

    Facts aren't opinions. We can dig the info, add polls, and find out data less bias than what the game looks to us. Or trust the majority's opinion of veterans.
     
    Reyer and United_Strafes like this.
  10. Demozic

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2018
    Messages:
    40
    Likes Received:
    8
    As i said i am talkin about na servers eu are different second of all in stead of talkin **** as i said what is your thoughts on it holy **** toxic as **** my dude the amount of time as person plays doesn't matter it does but it doesn't the longer you play the more you **** it not even going to go into it i said it many times.....
     
  11. Demozic

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2018
    Messages:
    40
    Likes Received:
    8

    You ****in right fact ok i need to dismiss myself from this thread pissing me off how dumb you people are...

    the fact you want to pay because u don't want to play normal is on u .... my main point is yeah make it seem like it is 100% needed to pay for extra **** making it pay to win i'm not defending **** but the fact yeah seem salty af grow the hell up and stop tryna play the blame game if the ****in game is too hard and u feel like u need to spend money into it then ****in do so or either quit don't go around bashing the **** out the game to people who would like to try it if u want a easy game **** man go play a moba game the **** u can pay for on here has soo little impact omg idc ...
     
  12. Josh28

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    366
    Likes Received:
    307
    No, dude. Everybody understands all that. But it's naive thinking. By that logic, games wouldn't benefit from microtransactions at all since people WOULDN'T buy anything. Yet why do they do? We are human beings. We want advantages by nature. Most of us play competitively. We want to learn our classes, get good gear, and pwn others. Or we wouldn't be playing an MMO and instead a solo RPG. If you have to go to school in a bicycle, it's natural to want a car. You don't need it and not everybody wants the car, but most do.

    You can google this to get more info... it's interesting. Did you know companies manipulated the Diamond market and now it's a frigging tradition? You don't have to buy a diamond for your girl, but I dare you not buy it. HAhahah! The cigarettes also did a marketing scheme. The aisle in the supermarkets aren't random, it's all assigned psychological. You don't have to buy more than you came for, but the average folk do. People especially fall for these schemes when they have the illusion of choice.

    We also live in a society where TIME is precious, so grinding endless hours is no good. People seek Bots, and cheats to save time and get things faster even if it means risking your account with everything in it.

    HOWEVER! If you enjoy the game so much and find forums toxic, then why the hell did you come here to convince us that your opinion is truer than ours? You aren't enlightening anyone. Only look angry after posting something you didn't have to post...AT ALL. But you did anyway. See? Human.
     
    Korvgubben and Fateneko like this.
  13. Foxens

    Foxens ID0 Ninja 61 EU

    Joined:
    May 3, 2017
    Messages:
    390
    Likes Received:
    197
    Bdo is convinient for people with money but less time and p2w for people who have to much money and nothing to do.
     
    Demozic likes this.
  14. Demozic

    Joined:
    Oct 3, 2018
    Messages:
    40
    Likes Received:
    8
    SOOOOO true but what main issue is people bashing the game just because the ptw trend they got going on my main MAIN point is the ptw is there logically but not forced yelling this game is hardcore ptw some people do discourages people from even trying it out and again doesn't help due to it being a Korean game i am not saying it isn't ptw but on the other hand it isn't ptw and you are right not that i'm angry just it is one of them things i can count on both hands the amount of legit post on this topic everyone else eithers says it is 100% ptw because they don't want to put effort in or put months of effort in and the guy next to them throws money into it making them salty so they start then cry about pay to win i just can't see how a game that only has the option for extreme convenience is pay to win verse a lot of other mmos it must be soo damn stressful to be in the game industry things are not going to be perfect but damn as someone said it is true i am very new but as a person who played runescape back in 04 to some what now ...

    this game is extremely easy in my book it pissed me the **** off getting tri on my rosar and dropping to duo or upgrading rings and stuff that req 2 of the same items and losing gear due to not having cron stones and thinking i'd have enough fail stacks about the same i had getting duo and i fail at getting pri or having 0 fail stacks and upgrading from 10-11.. what tops it off having a boss gear weapon and can't even touch upgrades on it anyone due to having no durability and i have no memory fragments i even thought about it to myself a few days ago like (why the **** am i playing this?)

    so i understand how some people feed i even thought/have got artisan fragments for durability but through loyalty or the pearls i had left over... having to run to shop and bank and run back to mobs due to weight getting too large or not enough bag space but really that is just the game i could dump a few bucks into the game getting inventory space more weight and bank space but to be honest it isn't that serious to me there are many ways to get more weight/bank/inventory space

    Long story short it has it's pay to win aspects.. but this is a Korean game people alrdy got bad vibes from them anyways don't make it worse saying it is straight ptw game because of personal feelings somethings people like some things people don't but people saying what is facts what isn't facts ptw this ptw that as i listened b4 ptw, pff, pfc, rwt, and the rest the fact people only throw ptw in for this game out of everything else is kinda personal feelings to be honest at the end of the day it doesn't truly matter

    Just pissed me off hearing the same thing over and over ask for others opinions on why and get told the same thing that leads to a failed excuse on why they think it is ptw.. at the end of the day people will pay to come out on top via through the game it's self other players via rwt or paying in-game currency for carries you are not forced to pay anything more then 10$ making it not really pay to win in my book

    I'm going to use wow again..
    getting legion and the wow base game with out bfa u got a grand canon gap between players it doesn't matter if you rwt with people to carry you in-game you will never reach other players that have bfa

    Paying currency for carries all the same doesn't matter if you spend 500$ in wow tokens you will still never reach players that have bfa forcing a person to dish out more money at the end and who knows the person next to you is stuck in legion due to not being able to afford bfa you just bought it every time the game has a xpack you need to pay for that xpack or get left behind. this isn't even convenience it is pay to win in my book as stupid as it sounds yes but open your mind everyone seems to ignore this and think it isn't pay to win.,.

    Bdo has everything available to the person even has a event going on reach 56 get the game for free. the amount of time you put into the game is what you will gets at the end if someone pays to get pets tents or what ever you salty and jelly don't bash the game saying it is pay to win BECAUSE it is a optional payment for extreme extreme convenience hey got money to spare get a pet a tent whatever

    I am stupid af small minded but at the same time open minded with giving people the benefit of the doubt and i am giving pearl abyss that because i've played for a month hours on hours a day and all i see is optional pay to win making it pay for convenience i even got another kudu pet making it seem you get 1 a month from daily login so paying for pets isn't 100% needed but hey i used my other kudu and my new one and got a tier 2 meh i would of kept it but feeding the pets i got now is so much money

    just a new player giving pearl abyss the benefit of the doubt but no one can show / tell me other wise on how it is extreme pay to win. proving my point even more..
     
  15. Josh28

    Joined:
    Mar 21, 2018
    Messages:
    366
    Likes Received:
    307
    Once again, not a simple issue. People are bashing the game because they feel betrayed. As I said before, the 'conveniences' have grown over time even though Kakao promised not to do so. They had no choice though. It's PA being corporate d1cks. So if you wonder why people keep complaining: it's to vent their frustration and calm the F down before going to another game.

    In my opinion, if you like the game and you are playing it without problems, NEVER visit the forums...Ever! If you read around some more you will find that there are people here who like arguing in threads WAY MORE than playing the ACTUAL game. Other individuals get orgasms for winning small arguments even if it's the same opinion as them... -_- Forum PVP, be the name.

    Many of us stick around waiting with a hope that Kakao actually listens to people and do something good. Better. Fix **** which they promised to fix but haven't and just ignored it. However, people leaving has not much to do with us complaining here. Most, (like ~~99% people) just dislike the game and leave without visiting the forums once. Right now, the game is losing people equivalent to those who joined after remastered and I very much doubt it's because someone posted that its p2w.
     
    levinano likes this.
  16. Alicia Dominica

    Joined:
    Apr 27, 2016
    Messages:
    1,616
    Likes Received:
    3,339
    Well, as far as I'm concerned, claiming that a game isn't p2w cause there are other games that are more p2w doesn't really hold up. Ultimately, there will always be something "worse", but it doesn't mean that something slightly less worse doesn't qualify. The important question is where should one draw the line? What still counts as pay for convenience and what is actual pay to win? You will get a multitude of different opinions on that and I personally find it hard to just agree on some kind of value/advantage without looking at the overall picture of how the game is doing and how time versus money p(l)ays out.

    With that in mind, BDO has a long history of punching their actual paying customers in the face: Pearl to silver ratio has always been terrible compared to silver-making ingame to the point where putting pearl-items on the marketplace is a straight pay2lose, even melting costumes is incredibly pricey considering how little the actual silver value means for someone exploiting sea-monsters and/or payouts in general. Furthermore, Kakao keeps supporting pearl-gift scamming through inaction, effectively allowing those NOT directly paying for the game getting an advantage over those that do. That and the simple fact that you "win" in this game through simple-time-investment, for which groups such as social welfare abusers qualify best.

    All in all, one can get actual advantages through the pearl-store, but these advantages are put to best use by people with a lot of play-time scamming those with a lot of disposable income. I would not go as far as calling that p2w in any traditional sense, more like a company completely disregarding their paying customers. But hey, look at what happened to the Russians...
     
  17. Benitez952

    Benitez952 Kioge Tamer 62 EU

    Joined:
    Jul 4, 2018
    Messages:
    37
    Likes Received:
    27
    I didn't understand at all the first post, but BDO is not a pay 2 win game. It's a pay 2 fast, it's not like if you are buying directly equipment and, you can obtain almost everything from market
     
  18. Escapism

    Joined:
    Oct 12, 2016
    Messages:
    2,216
    Likes Received:
    2,031
    Monthly subscriptions and b2p expansions are p2w now? I guess then every non-f2p game is p2w because you have to pay to be able to play it? But Infinite unlimited "conveniences" increasing your profits and efficiency for various activities by multiple factors is not p2w, thats only p2c?

    Are people completely 100% disconnected from what p2w means now? Its when the paying player gets advantages! Who exactly out of all the paying players has the advantage in a subscription based game when everyone has to pay exactly the same amount just to be able to play?

    If you play f.e. Runescape without subscription, you're not playing the full game, you're playing the "free demo" of runescape. Complaining that its p2w because you dont get access to the full game without paying the intended price for the product. Every new expansion in f.e. wow is basically an entire new game, you're not buying the xpac for "bonuses and benefits", you buy it to play a new game.

    Subscriptions/expansions/dlc's = p2w. Holy mother of god... There is no point in argueing anymore, I cant believe how some people can become this dense on this topic.



    And whatever stupid new terms you want to come up with for "p2c", "p2fast", "p2skip", "p2whatever", they're all just subtypes of p2w. That means they are all still p2w.

    A common cold is a disease, aids is also a disease, Just because aids is much worse doesnt change the fact that the cold is still also a disease and doesnt make it any better. P2W is the Disease, "p2c" is the common cold, figure the rest out yourself.

    If i gave you a choice of 3 syringes to inject you with, one containing the hiv virus, one a flu virus, and the third containing some vitamin mix. Would you chose the flu because "its not as bad as hiv"? Because thats exactly how you try to justify p2w and claim there wasnt any.
     
    Korvgubben and Life2v like this.
  19. Information

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2017
    Messages:
    228
    Likes Received:
    195
    So, when you buy currency via RMT it's P2W, but when you sell costumes it's not ?
     
  20. Gojira

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2016
    Messages:
    76
    Likes Received:
    46
    I'm not the biggest mmo vet but i have played a couple. Gw1 my first mmo had no cash shop or subscription just the purchase of the game, it had expansions you had to purchase.


    Aion was next game i played it had a subscription model then went free 2 play and introduced a cash shop. I only played till 3.0 something but that cash shop i could say was p2w. I remember a friend buying an rng box and getting a mystical weapon. bam instant upgrade.


    I tried rift, gw2, archage but didn’t get into them long enough. To me it’s just the model how they suck money out of you, i didn’t mind the sub model you paid a certain price and got access to the game no extras, personally i blame smart phones for this current model. It was the first time i saw the micro transaction take off in mobile games and soon everyone else was following suit and every game has its own flavour of how they will do it.


    Now with BDO they have done a great sneaky job of just balancing the convenience of the items so you would want them. Now there are some must items like pets and weight everything else is really just convenience but what you would spend on pets and weight even a costume would probably amount to what you would have paid for a sub of another game for 12months anyway.


    I suppose that’s the great thing about micro transactions vs subs the ability to suck more money out of people.


    I can see the argument of some people that it is p2w where you can actually gear yourself up quicker if you’re willing to keep dumping real cash into the game, because now with costume melting with the crons and valks it has widen the gap of what is convenience it’s not merely one off purchases like pets, weight ect.

    Artisan’s i never really saw as p2w more of just a pain of grinding memfrags, but when you can melt costumes getting Crons and valks gives multiple chances of hitting tet or pen and getting to add more stacks i can see why people call it p2w.

    As i said before BDO does a great sneaky job with its items and doesnt have blantent p2w items like other games where you can instant gear with a item for never had before.


    lol but RNG can still screw you.
     

Share This Page