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Fix Game Economy and ingame inflation

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by LightsOut, Aug 6, 2018.

  1. RageAgainst

    RageAgainst Mystic 61 NA

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    In our controlled market, if you removed preorders there is no way for inflation to take hold as players would only be allowed to spend as much as the items maximum designated value.

    I agree preorders take silver out of the economy, if it was working properly, but it can't keep up currently and that is the supply and demand part of the problem. Demand is too high for certain items, which means fewer are being sold and less silver is being removed. Removing preorders does not get rid of the excess silver, I understand that. Again, I agree the game is too event-driven and not as rewarding as it always should have been.

    There is a supply and demand problem in the game (it's not rewarding) which leads to a slow inflation over time via preorders as scarcity increases in between event periods. The inflation was made worse due to the availablity of ever-increasing payouts, mostly because of sea monster hunting, but territory owners have also always contributed to this problem as well.

    It's a complex problem, removing preorders does not solve the entire issue, it's a stop gap that would work for the time being I believe.
     
  2. RageAgainst

    RageAgainst Mystic 61 NA

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    As a player who's come from another game with a free market, I can completely assure you it would utterly destroy the economy in the game. Anything of value will increase in price exponentially regardless of whether new players need the items just as much as a veteran player with more silver available to them.

    You would only be able to sell your items for more silver if they were in demand. That is the problem with a free market, high demand items go up and low demand items go down both to the extreme. Example, more people want ogre rings, so the price would naturally increase on those, less people want seraps necklace, so the price would naturally go down on that. So if my income was based off my selling seraps, my income actually goes down rather than up.
     
  3. LightsOut

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    @RageAgainst can we let other people talk in here and contribute their ideas. You're kind of alienating this thread just arguing about things. If you have constructive feedback or ideas other than "remove preorders", please share them.
     
  4. RageAgainst

    RageAgainst Mystic 61 NA

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    I'm not alienating anyone. It's a forum for discussion, we are discussing. Anyone is free to talk in here at any time, that includes me.
     
  5. LightsOut

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    I was just trying to point out that we already got your point of view for removing "pre-orders" and to encourage you to bring in more ideas instead of reiterating the same suggestion.

    What I was hoping to achieve with creating this thread, was to gather as many ideas as possible and make a collection of the ones that the BDO community seems to like the most. Talking only about one point of this complex issue does not contribute much to the initial aim of this thread.
     
  6. RageAgainst

    RageAgainst Mystic 61 NA

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    I was actually championing @Benplay 's suggestion which you shot down and said he had no idea what he was talking about. My part of the argument was attempting to make it clear, it's a valid suggestion but does not fix the entire problem.
     
  7. LORDZERG

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    Did you guys noticed on last accessory box from attendance rewards, how hard was buying an ogre or tungrad earing. :) That's a problem of both supply and demand and the inflation. All players have tons of silver especially the castle owner guilds and the exploiters of the sea monster and some of them are both. We all need ogre's and tungrad earings, and when supply is mostly from the box from Attendance rewards and the drops are so rare, we are barely able to buy 1-2 of the items because everyone wants to buy as many as he can but the supply is limited and everyone has money.
    I hate that we depend on monthly supply from a box reward, but that is another problem not for this topic.
     
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  8. Nibblesdragon

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    To everyone saying they already control inflation because accessories break -

    JUST STOP. THINK ABOUT IT.

    Accessories are items. When they break, value is lost. Silver is not items, silver is currency. Currency has no inherent value - only what other people will trade for it. That means, accessories breaking actually greatly *increases* inflation. Fewer goods to go around, still the same amount of silver going around.

    These things increase inflation:
    Sea monster hunting
    Castle sieges
    Guild payouts
    Accessories breaking
    Equipment degrading
    Hackers grinding
    Events that discourage grinding/lifeskilling (octobois, koi)
    Events that add silver (octobois, koi)

    These things decrease inflation:
    Preorders
    Lifeskilling
    Non-hackers grinding
    Events that increase supply of items
    Cron stones
    Shakatu Boxes (please release NA thx)
     
    #88 Nibblesdragon, Aug 9, 2018
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2018
    R.Prescott and LightsOut like this.
  9. Ogi

    Ogi

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    Good to see this is finally getting some more visibility
     
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  10. NickDahlin

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    People that are already doing seamonsters and arguing that seamonster hunting dont need to be nerfed, fail to grasp how big of an impact it has on supply and demand on the market. More and more people are gonna be doing seamonster hunting because its currently THE best money pr hr. This will mean that people that used to craft items, lets take grunil as an example is gonna become rare on the market, people wont be crafting it and only new players will be grinding and selling it but just until they get their boat aswell and join the seamonster hunting. Accessories are gonna become even more rare then they already are, and preorder are just gonna keep going up and up on stuff that used to be crafted or gathered by players. everything will become much harder to get your hands on, we are talking hards and sharps, blackstones, memfrags, relics, scrolls you name it, its gonna become harder to get. This needs to be adressed and nerfed or you are looking at a "dead game".
     
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  11. LightsOut

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    I would like to once again encourage anyone who has additional ideas as to how to improve the economy of BDO to post them below and I will add them to the main post.

    Thanks.
     
  12. Nibblesdragon

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    You're absolutely right. I really don't think PA or the mods on this forum give the tiniest ****, but you're absolutely right.

    (TBF, they're probably burned out hearing meaningless complaints about this class or that class, so when totally legit and serious issues come up, it gets lost in the mix perhaps)

    The most ardent supporters of SM hunting are 100% going to be the ones who have invested heavily in it and depend on its income. They're the ones driving the inflation and being hurt least by it.
     
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  13. Nathan

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    Relax it's all RNG
     
  14. Von_Chicanery

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    Not sure if its been mentioned, but why not expand the ability to craft Yellow accessories? We can already craft Valencia yellow accessories(Crescent/Basi/etc..) Why not add Ogre/Tungrad to the mix? Currently, these items are mostly event driven(no one is actively farming Orges that I know of lol). Once or twice a month everyone blows a huge wad after the reward boxes come to town. Then they're gone until next month..
    I really like the idea out the Shakuta boxes btw.

    Ideas to chew on perhaps?
    -How about purchasing the option to look at the Nightvendor for silver(say something like 10m a pop) but keep the item rates the same.

    -"Silver Shop" for select costume, housing, horse, boat item/appearance changes. Don't make it better than the cash shop stuff per say, but enticing enough to spend money on.

    -Purchasing of loaded valks scrolls. This may be controversial, but why not let my buy failstacks with silver? If the average cost of a 90 stack is 1 billion silver, let me buy one for 1.5bill. This will enable 2 types of people, those who roll the dice building their own failstacks cheaper.. or those who just want to tap TET accessories. This is pretty much the options we have with gear atm, make it yourself or buy it.
    The valks and taps are still consuming massive amounts of silver. Stuff still fails, so I'm not seeing how it would break anything.

    -Finally, why not after breaching some threshold, allow people to buy TRI/TET gear outright from a vendor?
    The absolute WORST that could happen is everyone gets softcap(that thing they just gave us..lol). So what would that mean?
    Skill, not gear checking, would become the new META
    NW's might wont be snipe fests anymore
    More new people would be enticed to play the game(most of the people I show this game to tell me to shove it after I show them the gear enhancing system)
    More spending in the cash shop as people gear out their alts as well, they're gonna want weight/costumes/inventory
    More availability for end game grouping. Currently the ONLY groups are Gyfin, which 80% of the player base are not equipped to do and maybe 3% of the remaining 20 even care to do..

    Just a couple of my thoughts. Not sure how well received they'll be. Thanks for taking the time to start this thread.
    I've felt the same way ever since I saw a TET Dande Godr sold on PO for 1.5 bill prior to Octopus event and then 4bill after
    Now, TRI Dande Godr is even going for 1.3B
    TRI Seraps went from 600m PO to over 1bill PO
    TRI Witchs' went from 660m PO to over 1bill PO
    THIS IS MADNESS....
    upload_2018-8-10_16-12-22.png

    Whatever they do, I hope they do it fast....


    P.S - From my conversations with PA employees on support and Facebook, as it pertains to the economy, its seems that the developers are struggling to balance in game purchasing options with out of game purchasing options. There are TONS of stuff they could implement to create silver sinks in this game. I would have much rather dropped 500m on a costume for my Musa, than 34.00 USD. But that ain't gonna help their bottom line..
     
  15. Lurea

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    I dout this will work but hey.
    Also:

    You are joking right? Oc it does; you buy 2 acc for 100m each. It fails. You just removed 200m silver from the game.
    Same as buying Black Stone etc. You make FS; you upgrade your FS item to +15; So now you have to delevel the item. So all BS used are silver removed from the game. The list goes on.
     
  16. Hypotermia

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    Why are you creating post about something that you don't have enough information or correct information.

    If you had done seamonster hunt as much as i've done then you would know where the problem is and what to do. My past. I've done sea monster hunt for like half year and a lot longer than these new babies that pull **** money out of it.

    Per hour depends on purely on luck. In short while it can be 150m per hour or it can be 50m per hour. On avarage around 100-150 per hour. Ppl that claim they do 500m per hour or something else are talking ******** or got EXTREMELY lucky. And even if they do 500m per hour it just means they hunt less time and got their payout done sooner.

    Also with latest buff to cannons sea monster kill speed was increased by 100%. IF PA REVERTS THIS which will bring seamonster hunting down enough to stop the **** complaing show about stuff. There was NEVER 50% hp buff on candidums or nine sharks. Only YOUNG ONES GOT BUFFED HP. 50% hp to candidums and other monsters or cannon revert is sufficient enough. What players are asking is to destroy whole guild activity because they don't like it or are salty because they cant or want to do it. What i suggested is best balance that PA can do and anything else isn't required.

    New Drieghan gathering is completely solo and rewards players with 100-150m per hour. So its par with sea monster hunting.

    Then what else does sea monster offer to player? Nothing absolutely nothing. I can beat someone who has been sea monster hunting full pen if he is underleveled without any skill points. Its only good for silver and nothing else.

    Then ppl claim that sea monster hunters don't need anything to do it and they're wrong again. Dedicated guild with proper set up will do a lot effort to get it up and running.

    Why aren't you complaining about koi or octoboi events? You do realise that like 90-100% players were fishing for weeks and in total of getting few billions out of it. Sea mosnter hunting is increasing indeed for sure BUT its still VERY SMALL part of community thats doing it.
    On EU that are pulling it effectively as guild there is like less than 100 players in total then some other unskilled guilds just doing and thinking they do big money with it.

    Don't start blaming legit players for inflation. The amount of sea monster hunters is so low that they do not cause the inflation.

    So what does it then?

    Some history. Like year ago relics were 750k each. What happened? Community started the outcry about fishbots and in short two weeks even with relic event relic prices hopped to 1m to 1.25m. So lets look what now happened? Month back or so Kakao banned hystria hackers and botters.
    So yes they're cancer but at the same time the amount of materials they were providing to market was multiple times more than tons of legit players. So was this mistake again? YES IT WAS. I rather have few hundred hackers in game and more materials in market.

    So mistake was to ban hackers before thinking what it will cause.

    Then here is most likely biggest issue about seamonster hunting and its speedhackers. There is no reason to penalize players that enjoy the content and find it fun if they do it legit way. Guilds that do sea monster hunt with alt accounts and using hacks should have ALL PLAYERS in that guild banned. There is no way in hell that ppl would not find it weird if there was suddenly 500b guild funds and few guys doing it with weird alt accounts. Guilds that use alt accounts for hackin all know that there is hacker and should be permanently banned alongside with the hacker.
    And because there is hardly any risk to hackers when they use alt accounts they can pull +10b payouts per week and this is true cause of our problems

    Hackers are A LOT bigger reason for inflation that sea monster hunters that do it legit way.

    Then we had Octoboi event. Few billion over event to almost every player with NO EFFORT literally NOTHING. This had A LOT BIGGER impact in inflation than seamonster hunting (assuming we're talking about legit players only) thats been going for few weeks and very small part of community doing it.

    Then like post maker said. Year ago making 10-15m per hour was A LOT. Now i've done a lot of tests and no matter where i go with my current gear in mediah / valencia im atleast pulling 25-30m with avarage RNG. Players are pulling 20-35m per hour just from trash items and not rare drops.

    TOP OF THAT one thing that a lot of players are forgeting. PA just recently changed A LOT OF GRIND SPOTS AGAIN for no reason. This has resulted tons of materials missing from market. Im pulling close to 40m per hour at centauruses without even actually pushing it to maximum thanks to getting +10 bmc per hour. There is hardly any scroll drops at centauruses and same with nagas. There was no reason to change them this way and have a lot less scrolls coming.

    Inflation is caused by a lot of different thing and one thing is sure. ITS NOT LEGIT WAY of doing sea monster hunting. Its combination of bad calls done by PA and community. Commynity started the out cry over the hackers and PA didnt consider what it can cause and then PA puts down the octoboi **** event

    Also why the heck are you bitching about silver selling and not silver boosting / level boosting services? Thats just ****in stupid. Complain then all forms of RMT and not just one..
     
  17. Von_Chicanery

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    ^LOL.. you lost me after "banning hackers was a mistake"..
     
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  18. Hypotermia

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    If you cant see that then you're blind. U should've read whole thing and think about it.

    How is bdo's economy run? Its heavily reliant on events providing us stuff. Without events market will dry up because legit players are not able to provide enough materials. On fundamental level game should change a bit so we wouldn't be so reliant on events.

    So now hackers come into play. They provided insane amount of stuff to markets. Exactly same as fishing bots were providing relics where legit players were able to get them tons of cheaper.

    How does that not benefit all of us?

    Back in when i was starting to TET my gear i cursed ppl to oblivion that i had to buy relics for 1m to 1.25m due banwaves started rolling to fishbotters. If i had money to start it before i would've saved hundreds of millions

    Simply said certain stuff is on high demand all the time so high that legit players are not able to provide enough
     
  19. LightsOut

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    No, you didn't remove 200 mil from the game, they got transferred to another player (marketplace is player to player trade if you're not aware). Your 200m are now owned by someone else. The only thing that is lost are the 2 accessories that disappeared. Overall there are 2 accessories less in the game, but the overall silver is the same, meaning supply decreased, but demand stayed the same.
     
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  20. Nibblesdragon

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    What the actual hell? I mean... I am in shock. How can you possibly think this?

    Where do you think that silver goes when you buy stuff? Other than taxes, it goes to other players. Therefore, no, the silver is not removed from the game. Jesus christ...
     
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