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Lifeskill training clothes are another item that don't make much sense

Discussion in 'General Gameplay' started by yukishiro1, Sep 13, 2019.

  1. yukishiro1

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    Like cooking clothes, it's very hard to see why anyone would invest in these, given how lackluster training mastery is. In particular, two of the three bonuses from training mastery - increased capture chance and increased horse exp - are so low that using the mastery clothes is ALWAYS the worse choice than using the free alternative you get from the reward tab, which gives much larger bonuses to capture chance and xp rate (and also gives +training exp and +horse skill exp to boot!). So there is literally no reason you would ever equip these clothes for actually riding or taming horses. In fact it actively gimps you, since it slows down your training SKILL advancement, which provides much more useful bonuses than what you get from mastery. This seems pretty stupid to say the least.

    So that means, like cooking mastery, the sole purpose of these clothes appears to be to wear when you are breeding (or smashing, lol) horses. It seems hard to believe PA really intentionally designed these to be used solely for the 1 second out of every several days you hit "breed." Not to mention that the bonus here is so low that it's hard to see it ever paying off your investment, particularly for manos. Does another 1-2% chance at getting a T8 really justify the investment of billions and all that time farming fragments? You'd probably come out better just doing more horse training to level your training skill, since again that provides much better bonuses.

    Like cooking clothes, these need a rework so they're not such a terrible investment choice. Either training mastery needs to give much better bonuses, or the clothes themselves need to have some other bonuses added to make them a better choice than the free alternative.
     
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  2. Phoenixxx75

    Phoenixxx75 Lahn 61 NA

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    In my opinion the whole training masteries has been introduced solely to get people to enhance more and therefore buy more artisans memories. I do not find it to be worth my trouble but good luck to all the min/maxers that think it is essential.
     
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  3. yukishiro1

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    Yes, training mastery in general is also deeply lackluster. But at least the accessories get dual use in other lifeskills, so there is some cross-over benefit that makes them worthwhile unless training is literally the only lifeskill you do. The clothes are more or less totally junk.
     
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  4. chendu

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    Don't you have a skill learning chance up too ? just that would make it worthwhile
     
  5. yukishiro1

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    No. That used to be on training SKILL, not training MASTERY, but it was even removed from training skill last patch (without patch notes or any explanation).

    I mean maybe it is there and the tooltip is just broken...but the mastery tooltip has never shown increased chance to learn a skill.
     
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  6. Hemuk

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    Cooking manos clothes will have decent use, since the higher cooking Mastery the better %s scale, when cooking meals/selling to imperial, Manos will be the obvious choice and just for that alone TET is worth it.

    Training clothes are competing for gold in uselessness along side sailing.
     
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  7. yukishiro1

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    This is incorrect, but there is a whole different thread here on the first page detailing the math so I'm not going to repeat it here. The tl;dr is that manos cooking are terrible compared to silver clothes for actually cooking. The added mastery doesn't begin to make up for the loss of speed. The time to break even on the clothes when just used for turn-ins (the only actual use) is about ~8 months at TRI and about ~2 years at TET of maxing out your turn-ins every day.

    But it is true that for that .1% of the population who is committed to maxing their imperial cooking turn-ins every day for the better part of a year they theoretically have a use. It's hard to think how many years of constant 24/7 training you'd have to do to make the manos training clothes pay themselves back. Probably 5 years or more.
     
    #7 yukishiro1, Sep 14, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
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  8. Hemuk

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    Nah I'm not incorrect, cooking time is irrelevant when making meals because those cooks are very limited given the limited of the amount of mats, and you can cut it to 3 seconds with a draught and still get mass cooking, you just dont know what you're talking about cause you dont do any of the above, but I do, %s scale in a way in which going from 1k mastery to 1.3k will give you the imperial price % increase that 300M to 1k gave you, or more, same goes for mass cooking, before long; cooking clothes will be the difference between selling honey wine from 300k to 400k and getting 10%+ more meals, stop spreading missinformation because you saw a google sheet, the Guru 30 cooks are talking.
     
  9. yukishiro1

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    If you're a guru 30 cook and so bad at math you don't realize how absurd what you just wrote is, I don't really know what to say. The idea that cooking time is irrelevant is so totally laughable I have no idea whether to take your comment seriously or not. It is just so objectively wrong. The only way it is possibly true is if you do nothing but cook and just sit around doing nothing when you don't have mats to cook (and relies on the assumption that you won't be able to buy mats from the market either). But nobody (except stupid people) would actually play that way. Spending 2 times as long per unit cooking (in the best case scenario) means that much less time to do anything else. Time is money; the result is that the manos clothes just don't make any sense to wear when crafting.

    Your math is also wrong re: the impact of mastery clothes. Even going from 1600 to 2000 (which nobody will have) is not 10% more product.

    Ditto re: the impact of mastery clothes on imperial prices. Clothes will never increase your imperial prices by 25% total. You will also never get 400k honey wine boxes; the max is around 367k even at 2k mastery.

    But again this would be better in the other thread if you really want to continue to say stuff that makes no sense and is wrong as a matter of math.
     
    #9 yukishiro1, Sep 14, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
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  10. chendu

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    Well if afk cook the night on 5k cook ustensil whether it's 1 or 3 sec becomes irrelevant you'll have finished when you get up anyway
    on the other hand I4d say the manos sailing outfit would be nice to have for those +0.5 everything every 50 mastery lvl
    but yeah I don't see which manos cloth would be the best to have :
    • Processing is useless once you've burned through the mat
    • sailings nice but it's not transcendent either
    • cooking make me loose the +Exp% which is a great loss I'd say untill you reach guru at least
    • alchemy same as above
    • training is a joke since there's no skill learning chance +
    • Fishing would be nice but Rng being Rng ...
    In the end I don't see the manos clothe compensating for the loss in Experience +%
     
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  11. robertthebard

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    So I set up my cook with x number of recipies, turn off my TV and go to bed. I sleep for 5 or 6 hours. How relevant is it that a proc takes 1 second, or 30, if they're all done when I wake up? That time matters if you're sitting there waiting for it to get done, but if you're not? It's totally irrelevant. How am I going to know if it took 1 hour, or 3 hours, if I'm asleep for the whole thing? What else could my character have been doing while I'm AFK cooking while I sleep?
     
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  12. woots

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    PA doesnt look to make something that make sense for the game, they just try to squeeze as much money as they can from hooked ppl that still for a unknow reason see a meaning "playing" the "game"

    So life skill gear is just made to make you enhance, therefore have all CS item related to casino gear have an """utility""" for any life skiller
    Prior to that it was totaly useless

    Can you imagine ! You were "playing" the game without a real need of the CS, how awfull was it ! Thanks god of greed, now its fixed !
     
  13. Lord_Xenon

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    You like serious, but out of trolling you have no real point. While the energy nerf is cancer, mastery allow to increase your gain with investments. Before you 'hit' a curve and then had your max. Now you can increase this max to a new max.
     
  14. woots

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    No point ?
    How is the life skill income nerf without that said gear ?
    What investment do you need to even go back to where you were before that "update" ( irony inside )
    How is going to drain you ( time / silver / $$$ ) to upgrade all that life skill gear compare to the "gain" it provide ?

    Not saying you will also "hit a curve and then had your max" once you potentialy have enough luck or p2w enough to have max life skill gear....

    If they just wanted to upgrade the life skill potential you do realize that it wasnt needed to go through another cancer casino gear upgrade, or are you that well pavlov-ed already that you are unable to even imagine an actual recreative way to manage that ?
     
    #14 woots, Sep 14, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
  15. Catastigma

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    The Goal of Mastery are for people that want to do specifique content(lifeskill).

    The Mastery is not for making more profit for spend it on AP gear later.

    for a 24h/7d Cooker his goal is get higher mastery for get higher marge profit.
    The same way that grinder want more AP for get higher profit.

    Mastery = AP.

    Cost of investissement have no importance, The same way that get a PEN jewel (3 AP)
    does not increase your grind profits/pvp damage enormously, for an investment of hundreds of billions, for most.
    Dont spend on Mastery if you dont plan to spend all your profit into it, same **** about AP.



    Personally I see Training as a profit on the side of active wagon trading that will get a rework, one day. ( Training is still profitable with Jin-Viper making) same think about Processing, his profit is related to Trading, The time of craft 7000 crate a grana, We have the time to do active trading to increase our trading level and leveling horses as a bonus. It's the active life skill that has to be profitable, not the ones that are totally afk. Training is a sub-lifeskill linked to other lifeskill.
    https://www.blackdesertonline.com/news/view/2614

    newtradingquest.png
    Sadly,It's been 5 months we're waiting.
    We was supose to be able to get Black gem fragment from Shiny Golden Seal
    asdas.png
    My Peridot wagon take dust since..
     
    #15 Catastigma, Sep 14, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
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  16. Lord_Xenon

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    Only gathering got the cancer nerf. For cooking I get more than double what I got than before. When you don't call that a benefit I don't know.
    While alchemy is strange, it still have its use in turn ins.
    The upgrade part is, again nonsense from your part. While I agree for gathering(not base but special/rare), all other got a boost just for having it(not 1! lifeskill gear). So your point about upgrading is just pure hate at this moment. And for gathering you indeed look for investment returns, but the upgrade part(gem fragments - though without black stones useless and I still need advice how to get blackstones with lifeskilling) can be done with gathering itself.
     
  17. Catastigma

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    Lifeskills should not be independent of other activities, otherwise the economy diversity would have no sense... Lifeskiller need black stone. Grinder/pvper need food,elixir,shard,JIN-T9 horse, polish stone.
     
  18. Boink

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    That be great IF the lifeskiller only focused on lifeskill. It is not like mob grinding is suddenly closed out and they can make silver there as well.

    What I do hope for is that they provide high PROFITABLE recipes for HIGH masteries?

    Have you seen the prices lately? Since most of us will be able to make a "double" on almost every goods what does that tell you about your profit margins.
     
  19. woots

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    Actualy i dont hate, i'am just dismayed somes players are even able to consider that slightly interesting.

    Not only the game provide the poorest active content i ever saw in a videogame : running in circle ad vitam aeternam pressing 2-3keys to kill sandbag unchallenging AI.
    if AT LEAST the combat vs AI brought somes challenge, but nope ! the entier BDO mobs are the same grass bettle you find at lvl1 aroud olivia, but with a different skin,and few tweak regarding HP/DP/AP and somes CC immu here and there....

    AND you have to do that during so freaking many months to gather enough ressources to MAYBE see a +1 appear on their gear upgrade lottery.
    All that wasted life time for what ? a little efficiency gain ? to actualy start again doing to exact same thing as before to maybe see another +1

    The game ( despite one the most attractive VISUAL a mmo ever provided, and some actual interesting base idea ) is the level negative PEN in term of videogame design to bring any fun.
    ( but if its yours.. well... all my condolences )
    Unless BDO and 20years old kr mmo that had more or less the same "no content" is the only video game experience you had in your gamer life, it doesnt take long to get how BDO bring nothing on the table as entertainment for the players. ( But PA sure do use all the crappiest tactic to squeeze your money by hooking you, that's for sure )

    But if you are took hooked by the game to see it, well you will sure not understand what i'am saying.
     
    #19 woots, Sep 14, 2019
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
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  20. Smileybones

    Smileybones Ranger 61 NA

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    No need for a wall of text to state you hate grinders.
     
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