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Discussion in 'Ninja' started by easay9, Jul 6, 2019.
if you actually read you would see I was off it was 175 AP
unprotected or not as soon as he has a group around him you cannot just focus him and hes 1 shotting people with little to no effort
The class is a cookie cutter class compared to what it used to be there is no denying this
dOwN AtTaCK, bAcK AtTecK , AIr ATecK, tHIs aTeCK, tHAt AtTEcK.
Thats Ninja for ya. Its not necessarily the ap per se, but the "Special attack modifiers" and 100% crit here and there.
My question is, why does that class have sustaining heals among the short swords and Tamer doesn't?
Can I get a Self heal? No? Maybe? iono I just feel like Every Assassin class if they are assassins should All be to the "Core" Glass cannons.
I feel like Dark knights, and Tamers fit that role perfectly. They do nice burst of dmg. (DK at a certain AP of course) and when the toon catches a cramp from someone passing gas on them with High AP, its a trip to the shadow realm.
Ninja isn't as protected as most people seem to think, they just appear that way if they have super high FPS/Ping or know what they are doing. They don't do near the damage people suggest either at the high tiers. Considering I have 257AP on my Ninja but can't even 1 full combo the actual well geared players in this game, I have doubts that their AP scaling is too high. And by the way, those same players can 1 combo me without even full combos sometimes. Evasion Ninja on the other hand is only good, but yes, really good in 1v1 and small group killing, if they have insanely good gear. Like, pretty much 261 AP while also using full hybrid evasion set good. Outside of that, good luck killing geared players with an evasion set.
The thing I think people can't seem to understand is that this game wasn't meant to balance for the current low or average gear we have right now, because from what I can see, it gets far more balanced at high gear thresholds like full TET accessories alongside TET weapons and armor and beyond. If they do nerf Ninja however, I'd like them to revisit their awaken kit, because right now, Ninja uses not even half of it in PVP unless they are a veteran styling on you or trying to bait/throw you off by using less predictable moves. As it is, the average Ninja pretty much just has Serpent, Murderous, E Buff, transition stance, the Silent Charge iframe that works only half the time, and the occasional Katana Shower and awaken grab. Most everything else is from the mainhand, and a lot of that has been nerfed already.
And really, the only things I could see them nerfing, is, well... Maybe remove the stiff from Block Jump. The only other thing they could do is remove/lower Air Attack mod on the damage skills and buff the damage on other weaker skills, because it is pretty much air mods in general that is doing the real burst damage. Much else would likely be overkill.
Ninja self heals don't really matter in PVP outside of the E Buff. Pretty much just a PVE sustain. And to be fair, Tamer's are probably a stronger damage burst class than Ninja is, has a pet rather than self heals that can also randomly CC (literally can change the tide in 1v1 or small scale at least), has one of the most damaging 100% skills that can wipe whole teams in mass pvp, and still has large amounts of iframes to go along with it.
As for someone with high AP "passing gas" on a character... Doesn't really matter what their class role is, almost everyone dies when someone touches them at high AP pretty much unless maybe they built tanky. Even then high enough AP tends to trump DP builds outside of the super hardcore ones, and if they can't kill the DP with high AP, then it is very like the DP build can't kill them either in any useful capacity.
Notice how I said at lower gear levels they scale far to high in damage 180AP should not be 1 comboing a 300 dp target with ease. no other assassin class does this they all need more gear like 220AP minimal.
I also stated not long ago hes probably fine in higher gear fights but its the T1 node wars or in general 250AP 300DP capped area that hes hitting far too hard at these lower AP levels in comparison to most classes in the game and hes got iframes and is mobile doing so its not ok
I get at higher AP levels everyone 1 shots everyone else but in T1 we have to do our full combos
ninja is the main exception to this which is the issue. he should not be 1 shotting people he should require the same AP to come online that is how it should be.
Garmoth Heart on your offhand and 2x Evasion crystals in your armor. You will take much less dmg from Ninjas. Then try to hit then with AOE ccs, slow them and you have a better time. Yes, they have massive dmg, but, it's a Ninja, an assassin. A Ninja is 2shot dead with decent AP and enough accuracy, the problem is that evasion is not balanced.
Never fight a competent Tamer? They hurt at lower AP too. As for the other assassin classes, you are correct about them needing a bit more AP in general to shine.
Ninja iframes though are only partially iframes for most of them with the only super reliable one being Block Jump. What Ninja survivability comes from is actually a mix of those iframes alongside unprotected mobility in general. That and the frontal guard swaps and skill cancels. In other words, things that have to be aimed and timed
Other than that, not so sure that 180 AP Ninja is going to have the time to 1 combo people that are 300 DP in a mass pvp setting before getting slaughtered or having to run away, even if only T1 Node Wars. To be honest, not even sure if Ninja can 1 combo someone with 300 DP in a 1v1 setting with only 180 AP if their opponent is using potions like a normal person. Maybe depends on classes/builds for that to happen. Regardless, if they change the curve a little it might be fine, but I don't see it being a major problem in mass pvp either way.
yes hes an assassin so are multiple other classes they do not scale like him and I do not beleive they should.
they need to nerf ninjas scaling at lower AP levels end of story. There is no denying this about the class. Why do you think hes played so much right now compared to before?
because hes a cookie cutter class that needs less skill and gear then he needed before.
Yeah, you are not wrong. I'm not defending Ninja, I just wanted to help you fight against them. I am a Warrior main btw. I have a hard time against Ninjas.
This gif don't mean squat. He is doing serpent on transition. Ninja does not do that in actual combat. Now that damage just count half of it and that's the actual dmg... If a ninja trans serpent you is because you are bad...
Why is a Lahn player complaining about Ninja is my real question?
While i'm not suggesting Lahn nerfs unlike the OP with Ninja but - Lahn is more deadly than Ninja in some matchups, easier to play than Ninja and she has far better endgame grind than Ninja.
Easay9 to Crimson_Scarlet
Shadow Stomp is unprotected .
I mean - You're rooted in place for Ascension and unprotected. Meanwhile Witch and Striker has SA on Voltaic Pulse and Bound / Skull Crusher / Skull Hammer super armor flow respectively. Like what was said before - Ninja doesn't need a nerf.
Please provide me a video of you fragging out with Ninja in your T1 if hes that easy please and thank you. Hes a pretty easy class - right? Shouldn't be hard.
Beat me to it about the Tamer stuff
Tbh Warrior engages faster than Ninja with his executioner buff and good fps while having a superior grab than Ninja. We also requires good fps or playing Ninja feels scuffed.
lol these guys aren't even play mmorpgs.. ninja/assassin are designed to assassinate target in very short of time.. duh? look at ragnarok asassin, wow assassin, SWTOR assasin, ESO assasin, aion assasin.etc where they can 1-2hit delete enemies while stealthing, ofc they're squishy and their weakness is revealing items,aoe skills. then poof they're deadmeat..... so what do you guys want an asassin that go yolo in front?
and once again you say the word assassin ninja is not the only assassin he is however the only assassin to need 180AP to 1 combo a 300dp target
everyone else needs 220+ AP to do the same.
he needs nerfs to be in line with everyone else period.
Lahn is predictable.
lahn has to commit to her kills
commiting to kills do to her longer animations oftentimes gets her killed.
Will admit to she is simple to play I will not disagree with that.
shes high risk high reward and requires more gear to do it same with kuno, musa, mehwa, DK, sorc.
although sorc has a lot more iframe spam. and mehwa needs more AP(she needs a buff) DP scales on her though LOL!.
also your talking about protected skills vs non thats not the point the point is the damage output at lower AP levels.
Im not saying hes not high skill Im not saying hes not high reward what I am saying is compared to the other assassin classes he hits far harder with lower AP
and that is wrong doesn't matter how many ways you spin it.
What I meant by less skill and more cookie cutter is hes hitting so hard at lower AP needs to do less of a combo to do the same things he did before.
apologies if it came off offensive to the class that was not the point I was trying to get across.
so i tested it out in trial - ninja was able to do it at 180 ap - when he used his awa buff
but guess what - musa was able to do it at 180 ap aswell - without buff
didnt test any more cos the data speaks for itself "no other class can do it" "ninja can do it with ease" (if u have the buff ready)
my problem with ninjas is it's ability to get so tanky off a tiny bit of an evasion build. archers dmg output is far worse than ninja imo it's insane
to everyone who thinks evasion is overpowered and unbalanced its because the whole game switched to ap monkeys so obviously evasion will be stronger evasion literally counters high ap its a whole circle of how everything works evasion>ap>dr>acc>evasion
also as a ninja with 229 ap and still struggle to one combo most people in the velia 4 and arsha battle arenas this whole argument ab ninjas seems to just come from salty people who arent good at their own class and wanna call for nerfs to a class that literally has to put so much work in for its damage the good ninjas just make it look easy but we literally have combos that require us to use 14-16 abilities where ass faceroll ass classes use less than 5 to get the same effect
you do not play the game if you think its because of strictly everyone using AP.........
229AP vs 320- 340DP targets everyone struggles at that AP...............
229AP and you cant 1 combo a soft cap player at 300DP that is sad............
"come from salty people who arent good at their own class and wanna call for nerfs to a class that literally has to put so much work in for its damage the good ninjas just make it look easy but we literally have combos that require us to use 14-16 abilities where ass faceroll ass classes use less than 5 to get the same effect"
no they come from people who see the other assassins needing more gear to do the same thing as ninja.
sorc - many combos and abilities also hard to play needs way more gear then ninja to get same effect. X
kuno - needs way more gear then ninja also has many combos and abilities to learn X
musa - I will agree here his damage is also pretty high at lower AP but hes extremely predictable similar to lahn. a more simple class.
mehwa - in a similar boat to that of sorc needs tons more gear also takes a lot of skill but also simplistic in many ways. shes also predictable. X
Lahn - needs more gear then ninja. Very simple easy to pick up to play class I'm not gonna deny this but also predictable.
Dk - in a similar boat to that of sorc and mehwa needs a lot of AP to compare to that of ninja. also predictable.
every X is an example of classes that also take a lot of skill to do well with and has to chain quite a bit of buttons together to do well with so
saying your the only class to require this is simply false.
I never once said in my post that i couldnt one combo 300 dp players first of all
second of all yes it is because of ap because if people were still running accuracy builds evasion meme builds would still be obsolete I have 420 acc with my ac offhand with 205 ap and most people with high evasion get deleted unless they have end game dp to back it up or there's a significant level difference because levels do come in to play when you talk about this a lvl 60 vs a lvl 62 has their damage significantly reduced against them so there's alot more at play here than just ninja "needing a nerf" instead of calling for a nerf for one class and it happens then youre still bad at your class how about you call for buffs to bring other classes up to par with these classes that you say need to be toned down
and 3rd kuno is the only class out of the list of classes that you named that have to use anywhere near as many abilities in a single combo to kill
the fact that you put musa maewha and dk on that list period is laughable
if youd like ill write down a full combo string for ninja and i challenge you to write one out for any class thats as long as it
the AP is not the issue vs evasion. Late game evasion is behond broken to the point you cannot lose the AP in favor of accuracy because you will not have enough AP then to even hurt the target you may hit but you will not hurt.
on top of that evasion scales ridiculously on some classes and on others is a completely worthless stat to build.
Buffs to bring other classes in line......
yes lets make people 1 shot eachother even more.......
Do you even play the game?
Kuno , Mehwa, and sorc were my Xs were they not?
you gonna tell me none of these three classes take as much skill as ninja?
you are naive.
Im just gonna step away now because you do not know the game you play.