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PA has confirmed it

Discussion in 'Mystic' started by Hypotermia, Jun 8, 2019.

  1. Hypotermia

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    DR worked when renown was thing because they gave extra DR based on AP which made you get tons of DR.

    TRI kzarka was nothing during renown times.
     
  2. Hekki

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    Same as extra AP for DP. In practice it changed nothing. And in fact make valk situation even worse because valk perks give just small amount of static DR. And DR did not realy woked even at game release - before 15+ upgrades and awakeing.

    Mistic release was around one year(?) before renown times.
     
  3. Hypotermia

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    No. Renown was spring 2018 and Mystic was released at end of 2017
     
  4. Bnna

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    so the real question is - how valid are any kinds of surveys based on a player base that consists out of mystics for 40%. like that means - every time until now when they asked the player base what class they think is op - almost every second player that voted was a mystic. and it becomes really funny when you realize that despite that and 99% of the mystic players thinking their class is fine or too weak - it still normally lands first :D

    makes the already pointless surveys even more ridiculous.
     
  5. Asterotis

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    If BDO were a visual novel, Mystic would be the canon "Best Girl" to pick.
     
    Sevyrn and High Reaper like this.
  6. Hypotermia

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    Umm what surveys where? You mean community made surveys?

    Asking community what they think is completely normal and developers never just base nerfs or buffs because community says something is op or too weak.

    Data will almost always tell a lot more accurate information if something is off the charts. Players base their complains almost always on situations that they have very limited information or information at all like the situations where someone popped at my rotation and i 2 shotted him and got angry whispers how mystic is broken af when its very clear to me that the gear difference was over 100 gs.
     
    #46 Hypotermia, Jun 9, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2019
  7. Bnna

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    any

    k was ********. the 40% number referred to most geared players on KR. to be honest... it makes the previous points almost even worse though :D
     
    #47 Bnna, Jun 9, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 9, 2019
  8. Hypotermia

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    Any link for data of official surveys?

    I've explained couple of times which things have lead to that. It will balance out once the PvE buffs roll out for rest of classes. We will see decrease on Mystic numbers especially now that we have exchange coupons
     
  9. Bnna

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    yeah... ;D
     
  10. eddie972e

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    mystic has lost most of all her safe engages with this recent nerfs, mystic is not close to op. the problem is that ppl suck at pvp, ppl cant pvp for shlt in this game, pvp is not just about mashing buttons and hope a cc lands. u have to play passive an take ur time in trying to abuse an openings. this is just a gIt GuD issue:)
     
    Asterotis likes this.
  11. Nabuch

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    Oh god, I knew there will be this one numbskull that will COMPLETELY misunderstand the data. I guess that's why they are scared to release it... Dude. THINK. Use your brain when you see data. Look at X-axis, look at Y-axis.

    1. Let's extrapolate and say that 40% of top players play Mystic in KR. Do you have ANY idea how skewed the charts become when 40% of top players is Mystic? The only way to reliably judge other classes is to completely remove Mystic from the equation then, because classes bad against Mystic instantly get shitty KDR (they meet Mystic way more often) and classes good against Mystics have inflated KDR even though they might struggle in other forms of PvP (Ninja/Kuno)
    2. When Mystic kills a Mystic, it's 1 kill : 1 death, therefore the real KDR of Mystic is dilluted because Mystic vs Mystic duels happen FAR MORE OFTEN than other duels. It brings the KDR closer to 1.00.
    3. Because the class is so easy and strong, many idiots flock to it hoping to get class carried. They are bad and lose because of skill, which brings down the KDR of FOTM class. It's a known phenomenon. Old Valk with LSA was the most disgusting **** to ever grace BDO. But there were 5 people in EU that could utilize it at a level that made it impossible to beat. Bad Mystic can still be abused and farmed.
    4. Since bad players often pick the strongest class, the KDR is once again dilluted because the ratio of UNDERSKILLED players is way higher than for other classes.
    5. Because people leave less popular classes, the ones that stay can be considered "specialists", with skill that lets them utilize their class to the fullest. That boosts their KDR. Ninjas/Kunos especially.
    6. Classes that have good matchups against Mystic in 1v1 are REALLY favored in this KDR chart considering THERE'S 11 TIMES MORE MYSTICS THAN ANY OTHER CLASS (on average).
    7. Mystic has low damage, and in largescale is often ks'd by Musas/Zerkers/Archers and serves as a pull bot. Needless to say, pulls don't get you kills.
    8. Despite low damage Mystic bring a metric ****ton of CC to the table which makes it easy for others to boost their KDR, not thanks to themselves.
    9. Many classes specialize in following up CC. Archer does good at it while also being good damage dealer and CC dealer, he just has no risk follow ups. Musa is the best example. Musa thrives where they can deal Down Attack damage. Guy on the ground -> assault chopper Mushin comes in and cleans. Sorcs are specialized in 1vX and staying alive. These 3 classes will ALWAYS have AMAZING KDR. They would have good KDR even if they were half as strong.
    9. The reason 41 out of 100 most geared players play Mystic is because properly stacked Mystic with 280/370 is disgustingly tanky and can make the best use of the highest gear levels. She scales with EVERYTHING, and evasion makes her cancer. Compared to other classes she's just leagues above.
    10. She's just THAT strong and versatile.



    This **** is cringey really. Reminds me of the common fallacy people made recently in Poland. They released a public list of convicted pedophiles, as well as their current profession. The highest % of pedophiles was among... builders. Old catholic grannies immediately picked it up screaming "leave the Church and Priests! It's all these builders that are molesting children. Look at statistics!"

    Well, no. While this list had pedophiles, it showed profession of CONVICTED pedophiles that LEFT THE PRISON. In the end it only showed where pedophiles could find work after serving their sentence. But the graph is just "pedophiles and their professions". A minor detail really. It doesn't really "lie" by saying it's pedophiles and their professions, but that doesn't really help pinpoint where the danger really is. It's the ones that have never been convicted that are dangerous. It's THAT easy to misinterpret data. Please be more critical when you read data in the internet, it will serve you well in life.
     
    #51 Nabuch, Jun 11, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 11, 2019
  12. Hypotermia

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    Fine post lets go through it then shall we?

    1. Yes it was from highest geared players 41 out of 100 played Mystic. This doesn't tell us other than she is popular but meanwhile her killing stats tell us that she has mid tier kill potential. This means Mystic were chosen for some other reason than her killing capabilities in PvP. Very good example is how players are rerolling to Mystic just to grind Hystria and believing she is the best there. Don't get me wrong she is amazing in Hystria but do we have data that she is best? Valky, Sorc, Archer are pulling very similar numbers and for example Maehwa pulling 2400 trash per hour with 218 AP.

    In any other spot Mystic is not even close to top tier. (Sycraia still not really figured out other than Valks are insanely strong in there)

    2. Once again another player who thinks duels are the PvP balance in this game. No ill repeat myself once again. Developer intentions for PvP balance is in LARGE SCALE. 1v1, 2v2, small scale and so on are not meant to be balanced. So remember this when you start talking about PvP

    3. Yes Mystic is easy to play and because she does well in all areas not best in any she is easy to pick up and because this game relies on heavily grinding and obtaining materials to get better gear its easier to roll Mystic as grinder and make more than you would make with your main but this will change once PA has done their PvE balances. For example with the limited info that i have obtained about Strikers and their buffs. They will be as good or even better than Mystics in PvE and they're more certainly better in PvP in terms of bursting player down meanwhile in large scale scenario comboing someone is complete suicide so Mystic has no place in it other than CC machine

    4. You still think that bad players causes KDR to get dilluted? Sure there is effect but like i already said. Mystic large scale kill potential is non existing. To kill her target effectively she needs to combo her target which makes her weaker in situations where you need to out trade many players with protected skills alone and burst. Yet alone one fact what makes Mystic weaker in large scale is her 100% awakening ult that was designed around to have vacum effect. After the nerf her ult got left alone as it is and its DMG is over time with no CC so anyone can completely freely walk away from it. Meanwhile zergers, valkyries, tamers flat out just ult middle of 10-20 ppl and half of them die instantly

    6. Still talking about 1v1. Stop. PvP in this game is not 1v1 or BSL tournaments and so on. More often and time to time developers have clearly said that PvP balance is forwarded towards large scale aka nodewars and sieges. Everything else is in minor role and something might be adjusted according these.

    7. Exactly what you said. Mystic is CC machine in nodewars. She has no room to get kills which leads to part that Mystic cannot be OP like everyone claims her to be. And most players who you ask why she is op they say because she is best at everything when she is not best in anything. I agree vacuum is strong. Should it be nerffed? Well if it shuts the **** out from all plebs like you then sure.

    8. Funny how you say that classes are performing well in nodewars and filling up their role better but still being weaker than Mystic. ROFL

    9. Mystic DOES NOT scale with everything. Her dmg skills in awakening has fixed bracket AP scaling which means her dmg increases A LOT less than other classes. Same goes with all summon classes and patch notes that i've found gives Mystics fixed scaling 30AP meanwhile striker is 50, witch/wizard 80. I have heard that all were adjusted to 80 but i never found the patch where they did this.

    She scales with evasion but she is not best evasion scaling class in game after the evasion buff was nerffed from 15%-> 9%. Ninja / Kuno is. And with Witch/Wizard changes which affects the evasion greatly in large scale.

    10. She is not STRONG. Versatile yes.
     
  13. MitchDaDon

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    lets all reroll to warrior! to one of the top tier classes
     
  14. Bnna

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    does the kd ratio only apply to the top 100 geared players aswell though? bc i don't think it does, that wouldn't make too much sense to record such a statistic. few classes would only be represented by like 2 players and that does not give you any info at all. if one of them is an actual pvp player or only does 1v1 in aakman on a lahn all of your statistics about the classes kd are going to be useless.

    i also don't think you can extrapolate from the 41/100 top geared players being mystic to be honest - while i feel like every second player being a mystic on main hystria rota (which represented top 100 best geared players in the game before sycraia release pretty well i think) is accurate, i don't feel like this is the case in the open world at all. in fact most low gear players have an awful experience pvping on mystic, because not having gear on a super armor based class will get you obliterated in seconds against high ap players even on mystic. also they are on average by far not as good as players compared to high gear players and can't really make use of the ridiculous amounts of protection the class has. that however is also one of the reasons why i think the kd count over all of player base is a pretty ****ing useless stat. 500 rs mystics being useless trash is not very helpful, when you play a magic based class and you have a 620 guy on your spot that is also literally impossible to cc. also people forgot to tell this guy about the awful mystic ap scaling so he still kills you in 3 skills when you get cced.

    that being said - if i learned anything in around 15 years of playing mmos, then that is that if every top tier player does the same thing it is pretty much never wrong. i am still waiting for the first example of that rule not applying but tbh i don't think bdo will ever deliver. when everyone from top 100 geared players is running a mystic - there is a pretty damn good reason for this. and it proves the point of a class being op much better then any other points you can make.
     
    #54 Bnna, Jun 12, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
  15. WhySoSeeryus

    WhySoSeeryus Wizard 62 EU

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    im positive geniuses in PA took into consideration its one of few viable full dp builds and that the class kit itself is more aligned to support/assist purpose in mass scale. i mean.... how stupid do they have to be if they havent, right? :D
     
  16. Sevyrn

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    TRUEE
     
  17. Sevyrn

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    Finally, someone with functional brain cells. <3
     
  18. Hypotermia

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    But you do realize that the DP builds are pretty much only way to go as Mystic. AP scaling is trash and class is combo based so she cannot be beneficial in large scale with her dmg. And her ult is not that great either so ult bombing is out of question.

    So literally only thing she can do well is to go DP and be annoying and vacum targets.

    If you bring the argument that guild needs +10 to kill Mystic who has max evasion gear. Same goes with Ninja and Kuno. Both classes if they go full evasion they cannot be killed unless couple of guys got full accuracy gear same goes with Mystic. Plus Kuno and Ninja if they go more hybrid based evasion gear they have way more dmg than Mystics

    But DW todays patch brings new class to complain which is striker. Who is well lets say this way tons of better than Mystic now because his PvE is as good or evn better
     
    #58 Hypotermia, Jun 12, 2019
    Last edited: Jun 12, 2019
  19. WhySoSeeryus

    WhySoSeeryus Wizard 62 EU

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    my point is that simply comparing k/d is pointless.
     
  20. LightsOut

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    Okay. I usually dont jump into other classes threads but please be real.

    I play a Ranger, got some PEN armors, some mediocre evasion (650) and 271 ap (Kutum). Since I almost don't grind anymore I do 1v1's and rbf all day long every day and I do fight a lot of similar geared mystics.

    I recently fought a mystic with exactly the same gear as me, same AP, same DP, same evasion.. basically the exact same items.
    If I chain 2 knockdowns (the logest cc in the game) + 1 downsmash which is pretty much the longest combo Rangers can do unless we get rly lucky with downsmashes, I can take out around 50% of the mystic's HP. And that takes around 20-30 skills chained fast to take HALF OF HER HP.

    A mystic with the exact same gear as me kills me in 1 knockdown w/o even extending her combo at all. Basically in 3 skills I'm dead.

    If you think this is balanced, then Idk what to tell you.
     
    Fearless V likes this.

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