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Please tone down the Knockdown / Bound resistance values on Crystals.

Discussion in 'General Gameplay' started by Despins, Oct 22, 2018.

  1. farsay

    farsay Mystic 62 NA

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    the people who want this cc > dead game play, must be childish and do not understand the meaning of fun and balanced pvp, the RNG provides much needed balance, and some classes have the burst to make every cc a nightmare .

    this being a Korean game, the rng resist is here to stay, and for good reasons. you want perma cc? give mystic back her perma SA capiche?
     
  2. Otrsor

    Otrsor Sorceress 62 EU

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    If we do that how do you plan to kill a faster class than yours? CC chains must allow to onecombo enemys, longer CC chains are more skilled and allow more counterplay (by leaving more time for a teamate to help) and thus rng resistances are bad for that kind of system anyways.
    Agree with the less dmg and less pots idea but that must include 0 rng on CCs and would still need include a 1combo kill system.
     
  3. AtomicPotato

    AtomicPotato DarkKnight 62 EU

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    What a logic swap from one meta braking CC chains to other and if still fails blame for being gear carried, such a skillful player, oh and don't forget about permanent Iframes.
    Expect you just gonna quit game after few month's of forums crying after sorc become meta balanced class, as that Valk player does.
     
  4. Otrsor

    Otrsor Sorceress 62 EU

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    Doble float is a legit actual game feature, and usually the goto option in outdoors/largescale for many classes (sorc and ninja included) the difference here is a ninja can kill you in the doble float combo with WAY less gear than a sorc.

    If you cant kill someone in onecombo and you end the combo with a low duration CC like bound, stiff,knockback or float the enemy will stand up with some inmunity to CC time and will be able to spam skills on top of you, if we are talking about a high AoE burst guy with enough gear over you he can pretty much faceroll you, thats what some mystics and strikers, requires 0 brain or hands just a lot of gear. Other classes after standing up will simply run away faster than you can chase them and refill hp to full, if you cant do a longer CC chain to allow you to kill them in one combo then there is nothing you can do to actually beat that kind of cheesy gamplay.

    Right now only long CC chains that might include some CC resets (so KDs + downsmashes) with a shitton of timing and suffering a lot from rng (and thats why this thread exists, some player that wants to be able to overcome gear and not get ****ed by rng) can let you overcome players with more gear than you, if you want to remove that feature you are simply trying to make the game less skilled, dont blame me for pointing it out. All i said is, if they remove the chance for me to overcome the gear and i lose to a more geared player well, im into my right of calling him gearcarried.
     
  5. Rayin

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    She already has it, but your inability to understand your own toolkit makes you believe like Blitzball that Mystic is underpowered compared to any other class but that.

    Back to OP, no. We need more ways to break out of CC, less RNG, less damage, classes should self-regen less (Hello Zerker) and only then potions should have a cooldown of 4-5 seconds.
    This PvP meta where you can CC endlessly people only with certain classes even if you don't have the AP to one shot, is so ugly and boring that already during the first moments of Awakening release people were complaining, now with the CC changes everything is so bad that there are less and less people doing PvP compared to the past.

    But i don't think we'll see anything changed, afterall PA did it to turn BDO into a perfect e-sport. "Perfect".
     
    Columba and Netreiam like this.
  6. farsay

    farsay Mystic 62 NA

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    first of all, do you know me in game? second i have never said that mystic is under powered, and thirdly i think i told you not to quote my posts again correct?

    as a mystic player i will always promote that she gets fixed because i think she needs quality of life improvements. and again, dont adress me or talk with me or quote my posts, i dont care about you or whatever you have to say
     
  7. Crimson_Scarlet

    Crimson_Scarlet Shai 60 NA

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    I tend to always say the same thing when someone post crap about resistance and i'll say it again here, its a joke its broken rng based cc that even if you build to counter will not work because its up to luck. Will also add that desyncing also messes up with skills which are suppose to be SA but still knock you over different topic though.

    2018-10-22_618081738.jpg normal.jpg this is what my resistance is normally looks high but I can nearly guarantee you that I spend most of my time kd on the ground being stomped to death.

    2018-10-22_618088548.jpg buffed.jpg this is when mana shield and fg block is applied values are really high but same results get kd then on the ground till death.

    After getting tired of being kd then stomped I swapped out to dp meme were I still get kd and stomped to the ground but I just wont die in 3 seconds its more around 10 or more . Now when playing a meme build is the same as being in PA and charging into a group only to spend the duration being cc'd.

    At the moment they should keep there hands off any aspect of the game because they already broke it the first and second time round being renown and class balancing.
     
    Columba likes this.
  8. Rayin

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    How can i not quote you when you say crappylicious things?

    Sure, as long as you stop spreading craps when you obviously don't even know your own class.
     
    #28 Rayin, Oct 22, 2018
    Last edited by a moderator: Oct 22, 2018
    RoakOriginal likes this.
  9. RoakOriginal

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    All for reducing RNG. But also give more option to break out of CC (not perma SA/iframe BS we have/had). Guard with CD, cleanse effect (ofc higher CD than CCs). Things to work with and work around...
     
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  10. Netreiam

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    @Rayin
    Basically my thoughts on balance.



    Some of the best pvp experiences I’ve had in MMO were in Aion and Elsword.

    Both had the potential for intricate comboing set ups that could make use of almost all the skills in a kit

    Both allowed you to break out of combos (either remove shock in Aion or mana break in Elsword)

    Both allowed you to be competitive with all but the most elite whales with relatively easy to acquire softcap gear

    And both had ways to pvp with willing opponents easily


    I feel like the changes required to make BDO pvp better are just so freaking obvious but somehow these devs take the most simple things and manage to flip it on it’s head, turn it inside out, and make it unrecognizably bad.
     
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  11. Rayin

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    @Netreiam i think you can look at Dragon Nest PvP to see what a 1 vs1 or a balanced small scale looks like.
    That game was deep as hell. Flinching, SA, SAb, status with only one of them being RNG to a certain degree that could anyway be "calculated" (electrocution), i-frames, bouncing on walls, Aerial Evasion, Tumbles, counter attacks, hitbox so precise that you could walk away from an attack of a millimiter and so on.

    If only BDO went down that path, gear and classes would still matter, but not as much as it matters in this current game. If then they'd make gear less relevant, it'd be relevant among the same tier of players, but not necessary or an absolute winning factor and things would've been more balanced and fun for all.

    Btw since Moderators are editing everything in a savage way without deleting lines individually, i just want people to know that Mystic has 12 protected CC. I didn't even include all the skills that have protections but no CC, those are also plenty, so rotating SA is feasible.
    Good Mystics knows how to do it without too much effort, unexperienced ones or incapable to read tooltips, obviously don't, so whoever says that Mystic can't chain SA either lies or doesn't know how to play.
     
    #31 Rayin, Oct 22, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2018
  12. TaoMachine

    TaoMachine Striker EU

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    Just no.

    Hard CC like stuns, stiffness, knockdowns, etc. became simply "I win" method.
    There is no tactic anymore, no timing, nothing.

    On sorcerer it's enough if you memorize one stupid combo and you hold oposite player in CC-lock until he dies.

    There is no skill or ability to break out of CC or resist all of them for period of time and eat all of them without them taking effect on you - noob-proof CC spam.

    In 1vMany scenario it is even worse.

    It makes the game not even PvP as many sensitive-flowers keep claiming.
     
    Columba likes this.
  13. Netreiam

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    The sad truth is that I played DN but never got strong enough to get really invested in pvp. I was especially in love with the vertical aspect of the game and I intensely wish that PA revamps ranger preawakening to give her even a little bit of that tempest feel.

    I absolutely agree that DN is how action combat should be, with skill required not just aiming in skills and dodging attacks (which BDO honestly has fallen in with almost all attacks having huge AoE and I frame being more important than positioning), but also in forming combo chains by physically affecting your target.

    I swear if that game was open world and had an easier way to get PuGs, I’d probably still be playing it.
     
  14. Otrsor

    Otrsor Sorceress 62 EU

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    I agree, but we have V, its literally a second chance every 5 min (it should work when KDed tho) and in nodewars/sieges you can spam esc/escape if ur fast enough to avoid the downtime (yet you will have to be running around for sometimes longer than the respawn would take).

    The whole pvp of this game has always been about NOT GETTING CCed. If you got CCed before you were dead, if you are CCed now you are dead unless rng saves ur ass or gear gap is huge enough. The timing, strategy, control and pvp is about how you use your protections and ur CC skills to catch the enemy while they dont catch you, and this is better now than before where everyone could be protected almost all the time (if not all) meaning only desync and grabs could "outplay" in most scenarios, at least now you require to actively think of what you are doing and time ur stuff with every class.

    Just try to use ur protections better... you could be complaining about ur protections having long CDs and that would be a class issue(which as striker you shouldnt have, more of a ranger issue maybe), or being too static and getting outdmged while trading protections but thats the problem of renown,gear gap or bad design (which could easily be the biggest problem for valks for example) or having animation locks on ur protected skills that are so long that any grab class requires 0 effort to get you (usually lahn or wiztards problems) , but you cant complain about getting CCed once and again by a grabless class, thats you just playing like a monkey.

    You couldnt be more wrong.
     
    #34 Otrsor, Oct 22, 2018
    Last edited: Oct 22, 2018
  15. Netreiam

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    V isn’t the same as a CC break. It’s a combat disengagement skill. A real CC break would keep you in the fight, just remove whatever CC was on you and Ideally grant you a short CC immunity period to stop you from getting insta CCed right after getting up.

    Again, I feel like remove shock in Aion is the perfect representation of this, instant break from any CC, 7(IIRC) second immunity, and a 1m 30s (again IIRC) CD that made it hard to use multiple times in a single fight, but accessible enough to use in large scale conflicts where multiple fights occur in longer period of time.
     
  16. Otrsor

    Otrsor Sorceress 62 EU

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    As long as it had some kind of animation lock and no dmg/no CC attached to it would be fine i guess yet considering how short the time is to go full hp again is for some classes it would be a fight reset anyways, just like V.
     
  17. Netreiam

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    True, and that’s the main reason we “need” this one combo meta. Healing is way too easy otherwise.

    Nerfing pots, buffing DP (/cough remove renown), removing rng cc, and introducing a cc break system would be the global changes I would really love.
     
  18. Otrsor

    Otrsor Sorceress 62 EU

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    Im 100% on ur team and removing or reducing the big rng factor on KD/bound as proposed by the OP is a step in the right direction.
     
  19. Escapism

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    You're crying that you cant reliably endless cc opponents who stacked specific cc resistances against your specific cc types. Besides the obvious 34% ignore everyone can easily get and probably already has with 2x precision, kutum and valencia meal or alchemy stone, you could also get additional offhand gems for more cc ignore for your specific cc type, which you say is so important to you that it decides a lot of fights, since your opponent went out to get specific cc res gems as well, it should only be fair that you would have to get specific ignore gems against it.

    Then there are warriors & zerkers which have fkng inherent 30% ignore on grapple res. Musa/Maehwa f.e. also have passive 10% additional ignore on Stiffness.

    So wars & zerkers by default with standard gear and buffs have around 55% grapple ignore already, but with a kutum and offhand gems could easily get this to 85%+ if they wanted, and you're saying that the resists should be nerfed?

    Res ignore shouldnt even exist, or perhaps at best in the form of actual (and working) diminishing returns.
     
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  20. WhySoSeeryus

    WhySoSeeryus Wizard 63 EU

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    as a wiz, i hate my kd/bound things(big part of wiz cc kit) being resisted left and right (also, lowering my damage output by alot). also, i love it when i resist a grab(altho, kinda hard on classes with pierce passive/skills) as it is kinda death for a class that cant anicancel majority of skills nad doesnt have much mobility.
     

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