1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Suggestions to change OwPvP

Discussion in 'Suggestions' started by Drielith, Feb 5, 2020.

  1. Drielith

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2018
    Messages:
    71
    Likes Received:
    80
    I didn't abandon defending it. I just find it boring being the only one on defense, so I had hoped you would along with stating your opinion about my suggestion would also come with your own suggestion, which this thread is about after all. If you scroll a bit further down you'd see in an EDIT I still defend my system.
     
  2. Spartakatz

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2016
    Messages:
    6,803
    Likes Received:
    4,103
    Sure good idea. "Selling high honor bounty rewards, PM me".
    When botters would have to kill newbies now to sell their ****... crazy. Or maybe funny?
     
    zhagsten likes this.
  3. zhagsten

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2016
    Messages:
    3,601
    Likes Received:
    3,494
    If that's all you have as an excuse for abandoning, that's sad.
    Forums are for discussion. If you want to post suggestions without discussion, write a blog. Even the Suggestion forum is made for the suggestions to be discussed.

    So why don't you take my questions and use them to make your ideas stronger? That would be better than playing the princesses offended by the mere facts their ideas are questioned.
     
  4. iarilo

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2015
    Messages:
    26
    Likes Received:
    20
    Ehh I didn't say I want them all, I only pointed out that some classes will be the ones to suffer most from it. But its ok, really, I'll just hop onto the pve channels to grind on my musa and during those times you'll have to stay hours without a single mob or move spots/hop channels.

    Which you dont wanna do right now since, as you said, you will 'return again and again and again'.
    Though that wont work for you on pve channels I'm afraid.

    More on the topic
    As we know, PA is very scared of any kind of player interaction that has any meaningful impact. That is because of the goldsellers, or so they said. After all those years we didnt get p2p trading, they even disabled gifts and yes, while MP improved, everyone is still locked into a little box of mostly solo achievements.

    I can't see them giving any decent incentive for player interaction as long as they are so scared of goldsellers exploiting it.
    So if they did, it would only mean they stopped caring. Which they just might, after crimson release.
     
    #24 iarilo, Feb 5, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2020
  5. Drielith

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2018
    Messages:
    71
    Likes Received:
    80
    Your question was, Why insist so much though? Doesn't that sentence sound wrong right from the start?. What's there to improve as you indirectly implied more or less that non-pvp'ers shouldn't be part of OwPvP which defeats the purpose of this thread? or am I missing something here?

    And no, I'm all for discussion the thread, but what you've written have so far not left much up for discussion (If it's just a misunderstanding on my part could you elaborate on what you actually mean?). But it's also a thread meant for suggesting ways to change OwPvP and maybe in my naivety had I hoped some more would post suggestions, so it don't turn into a Drielith's suggestion thread and instead a community suggestion thread.
     
  6. zhagsten

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2016
    Messages:
    3,601
    Likes Received:
    3,494
    That's your problem right here. It doesn't defeats the purpose of this thread, but it defeats the purpose of your suggestion.
    A non-pvp player involved in pvp doesn't exist, it's antinomic. But it shows were the problem lies. OWPvP isn't about involving players who don't want PvP. And that's what PA does wrong: they don't want to take responsibility for a choice of PvP and risk losing players, but they don't give those non-pvp players room for existing. So you end up with tasteless uncontructive clashes where people cling to pure mechanical rules of the game when others invoke arbitrary made-up rules.

    So again, are you trying to make a good PvP system with non-PvP players? Is that really the basis you want to use?
     
  7. Sadalsuud

    Sadalsuud Tamer 62 EU

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2016
    Messages:
    1,324
    Likes Received:
    1,573
    So that was it, you're only bothering him for a matter of wording? Please make a suggestion instead.
     
  8. Kynreaa

    Kynreaa DarkKnight 62

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2017
    Messages:
    4,308
    Likes Received:
    2,737
    First of all what are non-pvpers doing in that area of the game? The goal is to get everyone to participate..if they have no intention to, then nothing is going to satisfy them.

    What is it about PvP that they want see see changed, in an openworld pvpve game...There is no suggestion for some of those types of people as they strive to find holes in everything..and even when they cant all they will claim is they just want a pve channel to want one.

    And no im not talking about zoning off areas.
     
  9. Kynreaa

    Kynreaa DarkKnight 62

    Joined:
    Nov 9, 2017
    Messages:
    4,308
    Likes Received:
    2,737
    PA just needs to bring in an outside team...like CCP.

    As for different channels, thats not the only solution. Iv been in games where you have different goals entirely based on if you participate in PvP or not..like a kingdom/clan status within the server.
    Channels would have to tie together which nodes or kindgoms are owned.

    Everyone starts in non PvP till around a certain level, like 49..then chooses the life as a PvP loner or npc like, non PvP kingdom citizen,..as a kingdom citizen your daily duties are kingdom related..not even leveling matters for them. There would be set kingdoms to join, like factions. and do their kingdom related political stuff that requires life skillers.

    As a Loner you can later join any clan or guild and you strive to maintain a foothold in the world. Clans/guilds pay taxes to the kingdom in charge of what ever nodes they own, the kingdom uses its npc militia to enforce rules you set in these territories you own. etc.

    Kingdom members could participate in kingdom sieges, but they basically turn to npc's and the kingdom rulers is in charge of commanding the army..and they take over land that way.

    Clanned members in this game would be node managers so to speak, and would own nodes based on pvp node wars victories etc. clanned halls and kingdom halls could contain portals to areas they own etc.

    Or you can remain a loner, become a mercenary, who joins node wars for pay, etc. have your own house, but you cant make portals.

    Edit: I could go on but does anyone care?
     
    #29 Kynreaa, Feb 5, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2020
  10. Drielith

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2018
    Messages:
    71
    Likes Received:
    80
    So I weren't wrong. You want a system that doesn't involve non-PvP'ers.

    You already know this, but PA intentionally make only a few grind spots good for profit as to incite conflict, but like an option would be to make more grind spots viable for good profit as to lessen the chances of running into other grinders and thus conflict.

    OWPvP isn't about involving players who don't want PvP.

    Well then, I can only say that's your opinion and I disagree with it. OwPvP at least to me involves that party.

    EDIT: Edited comment as I misread Sadalsuud's earlier comment.
     
    #30 Drielith, Feb 5, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2020
  11. zhagsten

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2016
    Messages:
    3,601
    Likes Received:
    3,494
    That's what I understood.
    You won't have a good system like that. @Kynreaa pointed it.
    PA intentionally created conflict on grind spot, and then intentionally deconstructed conflict with channels, they intentionally created PvP system with rules for non-consensual combat but then intentionally watered it down to make it meaningless. Because they are sitting between two chairs, unlike CCP.
     
  12. Drielith

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2018
    Messages:
    71
    Likes Received:
    80
    I don't really agree. I think it's more a matter of making the system rewarding enough to hit back and make deaths tolerable enough (Hence, why I suggested free resurrection on first death by a PK'er). To avoid the worst griefing I'm thinking of having a bounty system alongside the karma system, so if they grief too much they'll actually be double punished upon death as they'll also lose honor meant for buying in the honor shop (make honor items character bound so they can't be transfered to other characters or sold on MP). Through a bounty system some of the PvP players will even get to act as police for the non-pvp'ers further deterring the worst griefing behavior.

    That we can agree on. It's also why some of us want the current system reworked.
     
  13. zhagsten

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2016
    Messages:
    3,601
    Likes Received:
    3,494
    That's not enough. That's never enough against griefing. Your suggestion is implying that the second death is deserved and thus must be punished. In a system where you are given points for killing?
    The bounty system is even worse. Player justice doesn't work. There's history behind that.

    If you want to rework the system, it has to be done from the root. And that means you have to deal with non-pvp players one way or another, otherwise you'll occilate between meaningless death and people complaining about griefing. OWPvP can only be built on a population that accepts it. The current BDO has invited players far away from that. Then only you can build a system where something's at stake in a PvP encounter, everybody has their chance (fighting back, fleeing, whatever), and there you can think what constitutes a valid goal for starting a PvP encounter and place reward there (direct or indirect) and what's invalid and must be deterred or even punished (and don't stop at a slap on the wrist).
     
  14. Drielith

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2018
    Messages:
    71
    Likes Received:
    80
    If you read my OP then you'd see that I also said that for an entire hour they won't be worth any honor, so it'd be only for griefing purposes if you continue to kill the same player over and over, and would therefore lead to the PK griefer to accumulate an even higher bounty (and lose more honor upon death) and also lose even more karma.

    The reason for 2nd death not to give a free resurrection is more to prevent the opposite griefing, that is karma bombing which with this system would BOTH be karma and honor bombing.
     
  15. zhagsten

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2016
    Messages:
    3,601
    Likes Received:
    3,494
    You are giving a goal to go out of your way to kill others. People will be killed several times. Someone comes on a grinding area, kills everyone. People go back to their spot because their grinding spot wasn't the problem. The guy comes back to kill more, he won't make a list of those already killed, he'll kill everyone again. Your system creates weird behaviours. And the bounty system even more.

    You are trying to tweak a broken system, you think within that system, and you're still stuck with karmabombing, which is the result of what said earlier: "tasteless uncontructive clashes where people cling to pure mechanical rules of the game when others invoke arbitrary made-up rules." Arsha is a similar tweak, and it actually works better. Still there's so much in BDO that doesn't fit an interesting OWPvP that it's all you can get: a "lite" version. Adding more systems on top of it will just make it more bound to be exploited.
     
  16. AZzalor

    AZzalor EU

    Joined:
    Aug 3, 2016
    Messages:
    4,542
    Likes Received:
    3,931
    It's a bad solution. Adding special channels to solve the owpvp problem has already been annoucned to have failed. I don't see why adding more of a failed mechanic would make it better.
     
  17. Capitaine Courage

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2016
    Messages:
    2,005
    Likes Received:
    2,215
    I don't neither, so I would make a pleasure to grind upon you, leaving absolutely no mobs to you, and no other solution for you but just swapping chanels.
    Oh, mind you, since you won't get killed by another player your ego won't be hurt, but in fine you'll just be in the exact same situation, meaning you won't be able to grind the spot you want, just having lost even more time while my karma won't move.
    Long story short, what I try to make you understand is that there are very efficient ways to disrupt other players gameplay that don't involve PvP , if that's really the thing that concerns you.
    Regarding how the game is set, how the grindspots are set,how players groups and shared XP / loot are stupidly managed well, what will happen with pure PvE channel is that the best grindspts will still be totally privatized by the most powerful players, and if such players don't want to leave anything for you to grind, believe me, you won't have anything indeed, be it on a PvX or a pure PvE channel.
     
    #37 Capitaine Courage, Feb 5, 2020
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2020
  18. nolasigns

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2018
    Messages:
    1,456
    Likes Received:
    820
    Good. Finally the right attitude. No one should give a **** about "grind spots" should be killing those that are dumb enough to sit in one little circle, in an owpvp game, repeatedly, until maybe they find a better path that isn't centered around a stupid idea generated by the powerful to create dumb asses that would abide by those ideas as some kind of honor system.
     
  19. Mana_Mafia

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2017
    Messages:
    986
    Likes Received:
    934
    WTF are you talking about? Oh, right, you're making things up.

    I've played MMORPGs my entire life and have never once participated in a system like the one you describe. "Typical" MMO feature my ass.
     
  20. Capitaine Courage

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2016
    Messages:
    2,005
    Likes Received:
    2,215
    When you look at how player groups are managed in BDO, it's like they did their best to prevent players from grouping and grinding together, while they could on the contrary incentivize it (bonus XP, bonus loot, shared buffs, etc), meaning that encountering another player on a spot could be a good news, it's actually not the case at all except for very specific spots. Hence, with these settings, a pure PvE channel can't solve this problem if grouping is still a deterent insead of being an oppotunity.
     

Share This Page