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Wizard/witch does not need flow damage changed.....

Discussion in 'Witch/Wizard' started by LordCrusty, Aug 27, 2019.

  1. LordCrusty

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    Okay so i was listening to the pod cast yesterday and the people who are advocating for our flow damage to be increased so we do more damage are insane and don't know what they are talking about.

    Right now wizard and especially witch are the best large scale class in the game, we are the only class in the game that can safely i-frame into a large group of people from a good distance and drop an aoe that hits up to 10 people with wiitch also being able to CC those that do not die with slow downs and an evasion debuff.

    If our damage was increased we'd i-frame into a group of people kill ~10 of them heal and do it again. With our damage being restricted it means we teleport in at our own risk. Do you people really want wiz and witch to teleport into a group of people and 1-2shot up to 10 people with no risk of dying? (I say no risk of dying because our aoes would almost definitively kill everyone around us with more damage scaling)

    If you take my wizard for example, i sit at 5,000HP with 5,500HP being try hard mode and have 269/269/297, that isn't even with pen armors or weapons with caphras. If i had pen C9 caphras in my armors i'd be upwards of 6,000HP and 346+DP and if i had pen weapons and a couple more tet acc i'd be 284-296 AP depending on if i use distortions.

    If you break that down wiz/witch can get 5500-6000HP 294/294/346+ whale tendons and magic shield (lets assume no PA) Do you really want someone like that i-framing into a group of people and massacring them with higher damage scaling?

    With the new Shai class you could add 1500 more hp and AP bonus.

    If they increased our damage on our flows they would have to heavily nerf the damage based on how many targets we hit.

    (Numbers used in this are based on my own progression and does not contain pen acc or future potential items)So you can imagine it's more dangerous with those that are better geared
     
    #1 LordCrusty, Aug 27, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2019
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  2. WhySoSeeryus

    WhySoSeeryus Wizard 63 EU

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    with 297 dp question is can you even cata into bolide and finish casting it without dying with the gear people are rocking these days (lets presume t2 nodes)

    with 269 it means u r at serious peak performance for wizard awakening (due to ap bonuses being huge) and your flows are stagnating from few ap brackets before. sadly, the moment people have no respect for your awakening damage, you are just like a piece of grass on the field with them driving lawnmower towards you.

    yes, pet scaling needs to be fixed somehow. in a game where gear is king, making good par of our kit not scale with it is simply bad game design. more and more people are wearing multiple pen armors and their dr is just making flows almost irrelevant.


    witch surprisingly is feared when people see her doing her voltaic but that is because devs made it bonkers unbalanced for a single skill.
     
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  3. Wrapped In Plastic

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    The scaling past 269 isn't very good for casters. That's part of the issue. Other classes are one shotting since they scale well, but mages are stuck with fixed AP on flows, not allowing them to take advantage of gearing up AP wise. The numbers will have to change on flows, but it should be fixed to be based off your own AP. Same goes for other classes that have pets with fixed AP. It's lazy design, and it doesn't reward progression.
     
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  4. LordCrusty

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    Again problem with our damage scaling higher would mean ~10 people at a time would be one shot in large scale pvp causing our class to be way to overpowered. We'd simply kill ~10 heal and repeat leaving no risk of dying ourself
     
  5. WhySoSeeryus

    WhySoSeeryus Wizard 63 EU

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    there are classes that do that with ease now with high gear. we r kinda stuck performance wise and require way more gear just to keep up.

    we would still have same issues in 1v1 as now even with flows scaling properly.


    this is not about "make wizard great again" its about proper scaling with billions upon billions worth of gear acquired. this fix would probably mean less efficiency on lower gear-score levels for flows and probably further balancing needed.


    just to add, fighting and overpowering softcap dp is not a problem for ANY class in the game if u have 269 ap. **** gets real when people actually have gear.
     
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  6. NoisyBoy

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    Grabs meta, the time of tping kill everything and leave is long gone (If you arent playing with - 40gs guys) heal is also unprotected. Capped nodes doesnt means everything since as they said the balance and gs in wich each class perform at his peak its different. Also those fixed scaling on pets makes you lose a ton of damage, and giving x30hits or making unbalanced skills isnt gonna fix it(Hi witch) They should just fix actual issues instead doing roundabouts and creating new issues.
     
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  7. WinterRED

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    There's 0% chance that our flows would get buffed AP scaling without the base stats being scaled back (Maybe 1% since it's PA). Imo that's exactly what they should do, but then shift some power over to Mage's defensive options to scale a bit better and help their 1v1. And yes I think we can all agree something needs to be done about protected area.
     
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  8. LordCrusty

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    How many other classes do you know that can aoe up to 10 people 360 Degrees around the caster in a super armor that reduces around 40% of incoming damage on ~7 second cool down. And you want higher damage scaling in pvp? Our damage is purposely like the way it is to prevent us from being over powered.


    What people don't seem to understand is once people start catching their armors up the same level as the end game weapons things will change drasticly from a 1 shot meta.

    Right now compareitivly more people have pen weapons then pen armors. AKA End game damage vs non end game tankyness, people expect not to be one shot and it's funny af.

    It's just to strong to have more damage in pvp with the way our aoes function in terms of reduced damage and super armors, not counting magic shield or whale tendons.
     
    #8 LordCrusty, Aug 27, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2019
  9. WhySoSeeryus

    WhySoSeeryus Wizard 63 EU

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    not all superarmor skills have high (id say some any)reductions. u can test it yourself. some just get u melted midcast.
    as for how many classes can kill many people at once, well, theres a list... :D

    people that get deleted by tp in and full skill rotation (takes a while even with full buffs) are guys that got blindsided or that didnt put up blocks or some kind of other defensive moves considering our damage and ccs are far from instant.


    im not advocating pure buff, im saying it should be brought in line to work with gear somehow. the way it is makes it way too efficient at certain situations and gear and way underwhelming at others.
     
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  10. LordCrusty

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    Blind siding it what wizards and witches do in large scale we teleport in and aoe while being in a super armor that reduces incoming damage.
     
  11. Wrapped In Plastic

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    And what do you think your damage is going to look like when you start fighting people with pen armor? I'm near 290AP, and my awakening alone
    has next to no kill potential on most classes.
     
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  12. NoisyBoy

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    Anyone who thinks wiz is all right past softcap is simpley wrong. All guys claiming witchards are op are usually 400 gs guys who got deleted by that superb ap scaling fix on pets
     
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  13. WhySoSeeryus

    WhySoSeeryus Wizard 63 EU

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    basicallymost often our awakening is more less defensive tool very vulnerable to grabs and hail mary full prebuffed teleport (often suicide) kit. our range preawaken scales better so we have to use that ... problem being these nukes (mostly projectile type) are so badly coded you often cant hit even a walking target let alone someone spamming mobility skills... and they are fairly slow compared to other ranged classes.... hell, even some melee classes have faster ranged options. not to mention good part of the nuking kit is limited in a fact that u have to use prerequisite spell first which is also slow and most of them dont really deal any significant damage. if anyone is focused enough to go for you while u try to nuke from "safety" chances are he will get to you faster than u even cast prereq nuke and ofcourse then he gapes you coz u r totally unprotected. i would like to say this is not a cryfest but trying to analyze our skillset objectively.

    then theres the issue of our addons which are fairly weak compared to most other classes.
     
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  14. Noixi

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    I have 304 DP.
    I am such a wet and used paper tissue, that when a WELEE even LOOKS at me, I die within 2 seconds.

    I have NEVER seen any Wiz/Witch dominate any NW, including sieges, of which I was in 2 winning sieges once.
    And where I've played NW's like 2+ times every week for 2 years.

    NEVER.

    I've never 1 shot anyone.
    NOT EVER. But then again, having a MEASELY 242 AP, that's why.

    I've never even kept some one CC'd and killed them dead like I see happening to me ALL THE TIM.
    Oh except on me,. I'm dead usually within 1 second of WELEE contact.

    ONE SECOND, no exaggeration.
    No, literally, watch WELEE get to me, count One Mississippi, Two Mississippi, DEAD. on a usual basis.

    I am SOOOOO TIRED of people saying the game I'm playing, supposedly has Wiz/Witch as GODS, and OP GODS at that,

    This game is Level >>>>>>> Gear >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Everything Else.
    Class is not the issue, other than ranged dps does not exists in blo (downgraded spelling).

    If I had 300 AP as opposed to my PATHETIC 242 AP, I'd 1 shot people too.

    But there are 2 ways this can get fixed.

    A#1) Add ranged dps of 1000000% TTK in 6 seconds or less at 150+ feet.
    2) Switch to even a HALF-AS-GOOD game.

    Option #2 has been looking better and better to me lately.
    Option A#1 is more of a fairy tale than me getting PEN anything for gear.
     
  15. Claydough

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    I framing into a pack of people


    Are we playing the same game?
     
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  16. Crimson_Scarlet

    Crimson_Scarlet Shai 60 NA

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    The amount of times I've attempted to teleport only to be KD during the animation especially trying to PA engage is stupid whether it be from the begining of the animation or mid way getting knocked out is stupid. Similarly getting KD while in full SA skills that happens against 1 person let alone while inside a blob.

    I do get where the op is coming from in regards of 1 witch being able to delete people though this tends to always be during Sages, PA and E buff combo ,outside of that it rarely happens this is from a node war , siege and rbf perspective as the chance of going in and coming out alive even with V is slim.

    Now there is also the issue of being grabbed whilst inside the blob 9/10 you will be grabbed that's just how it is whether it be a zerk or valk,warrior who happen to sitting in block , striker,mystic who are always walking backwards, and then there are also lahns who can grab you from a mile away, though rarely rangers since they're to busy spamming shot gun and would rather backflip away.All those classes can and will grab you the moment you come out of the teleport.

    Witches/Wiz are top tier but thats in respect to their overall performance regarding their effectiveness in pvp we're opportunist when it comes to engages outside of PA rotations for close combat aside from that we tend to be using meteors and blizzard whilst in the blob or sitting on walls and roofs.

    https://gfycat.com/sombermetallichogget

    https://gfycat.com/heavyeagergalapagostortoise

    Though sometimes you do get lucky.
     
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  17. Maginha

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    Our tp counts as an iframe, soooo ye, seems you play a different game :D
    Jokes aside, i dont like our flow scaling, but i have to agree with the poster that said we would be op af if we get proper ap scaling on pet/flow... imagine a 285+ap witch, that now can alrdy delete 4+ players in a proper bomb combo with 2-3x more flow dmg, that would be so broken.
     
  18. Fake_Alice

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    im 285 witch i cant "delete" 360 dp players unless they are afk. same ap musa can.
     
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  19. WhySoSeeryus

    WhySoSeeryus Wizard 63 EU

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    why do u presume that if they fixed scaling our damage would be that much bigger? i would expect it to follow the curve and to be much weaker at lower ap, thus requiring further balancing..... but by logic alone it should be higher on higher gear.


    also, witch bombing runs are so much superior to wizard ones, thanks to developers being idiots and putting evasion debuff on voltaic out of all skills.
     
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  20. Rena

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    We can tp and get grabbed and die or, (if we are lucky) hit 10 people, 9 of wich get no damage, 1 die maybe if i'ts low hp already.

    (hitting 10 ppls mean nothing if dmg is shared and if you hit 100, 10 ppls get 10 damage)

    Don't go rbf where ppls whit 400 gs join once a day becouse they need the energy to life skills.. try siege whit ppls whit the same gs...
     
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